BREAKING: “Red Rose” Rescuers Now Sued by Biden’s DOJ

*This is an AI generated transcript, and may contain errors*

Mark Harrington (00:01):

Friends, we’ve got breaking news, and that is that two organizations and seven pro-life activists have been charged with violating the freedom to access clinic entrances law. This comes right after nine activists being sentenced to prison just last week for violating face. What do you need to know about it and what can you do? We’ll talk about that today on the program

(00:37):

So you don’t have to be following politics very closely to see that the pride in his administration is persecuting its enemies. Obviously, we have the cases of Donald Trump now, several of those. He’s being prosecuted for what, because he’s the opponent of the sitting president. I think we all understand that, but it goes way beyond that. The Biden administration is using the instrumentalities of government, specifically the Department of Justice to take down his political enemies. And we’re seeing that now with these, the sentencing of nine peaceful pro-life activists who violated supposedly the freedom to access clinic entrances law. And we have breaking news as well. And that is that other activists have also been charged with face this time, not criminal face. This is civil face and we want to talk about that today with Monica Miller, who’s the president of Citizens for a Pro-Life Society. Monica, thanks for taking the time to be on the program. I know it’s been a crazy couple of weeks as you’ve been in Washington at the sentencing of these nine activists. If you would give us a quick update on that. I had Martin Cannon from Thomas Moore Society on last week to talk about these particular cases. Give us a full update on the sentencing of these individuals, if you would, to start out

Monica Miller (02:14):

Right. I spent 10 days in Washington DC I’m trying to decompress at the moment. I

Mark Harrington (02:21):

Bet

Monica Miller (02:21):

It was one of the most bizarre intense weeks of my life. And that’s saying something. Okay, so I was there for all eight of the rescuers individually, one right after another, starting last Tuesday. The first person to be, in fact, actually, I can’t really remember who was first, but in any case, there were eight.

Mark Harrington (02:48):

There was Lauren Handy.

Monica Miller (02:49):

Lauren, thank you. Thank you. Yes, Lauren Handy. How could I forget? The last person to be sentenced will be Paulette Harlow, and that’s on the 31st of this month. So she’ll be the last, that will be number nine. So Lauren got the most prison time, federal prison time, 57 months. It basically comes down to four years, nine months with the nine months already paid because they’ve been sitting in jail since last,

Mark Harrington (03:24):

Yeah, time served, right?

Monica Miller (03:25):

Time served. So she has a four month jail term. There is good time apparently, even in federal prison. So she might do about three and a half or three and three quarters years of that time. She’ll be 33 years old when she gets out. She’s 30 years old now. So then it went downhill from there. Jonathan Darnell, who helped organize this rescue at the San Angelo Washington Sur Center, that’s the abortion clinic. This guy does abortions through the ninth month of pregnancy, which is unquote right legal in the state of Maryland. And he got 34 months. So his was the second harshest sentence. Joan Andrews Bell and Jean Marshall got 27 months. Heather Ione, who was sentenced yesterday, 24 months. Rosemary Herb Garrity, I can’t remember off the top of my head. I think somewhere within the 24 months range. Was it 27 as well? I

Mark Harrington (04:26):

Believe so, yeah.

Monica Miller (04:28):

And then it was John Hinshaw again, whatever that, I have notes. I have 30 pages of notes.

Mark Harrington (04:35):

No, I understand. Wasn’t Will Goodman one among them?

Monica Miller (04:38):

Yes, yes, exactly. And Will Goodman,

(04:42):

Here’s the thing. It’s as if you are in two different worlds, two different views of this particular rescue. There’s the view of the DOJ and the prosecutors and the view of Judge Colleen Kohler Cat, the federal judge who sentenced, everyone who presided over this debacle and the pro-life view. Okay, let me give you an example of what I’m talking about. Perhaps the most egregious lie that’s coming out of this trial has to do with Jean Marshall. Now, Jean Marshall, I think is 74 years old. She’s a registered nurse, practiced nursing for over 30 years. Alright? Now, unfortunately, the timing on this rescue was somewhat off. Now what do I mean by that? Late term abortions at San Angelo’s Abortion Center is a three day procedure. Women were coming on the third day. In other words, their babies were already dead.

(05:56):

So ideally they should have been there on the first day where he is now doing the Digoxin injection and the Lamin area, he used to kill these babies as we see in a live action undercover video. He used to cut the cord, and so the baby starves to death. But it’s a slow process and it takes more time. And the digoxin, the baby’s dead probably within an hour or however, it’s a lot sooner. The third day, the babies are most likely already dead. The moms are actually going into labor and that’s when they come back to the abortion mill and they deliver dead babies in his office. Okay? One of the women who was coming was an Indian woman, her pseudonym, all these witnesses had pseudonyms, shanty, holler. She was there with her husband. Supposedly this baby had a lot of physical deformities, and that’s why they were there for the abortion possibly.

(07:01):

And it’s in the transcript where she may have mentioned Shanti holler that the baby was missing limbs, whether it was the arms or the legs or both or whatever. Okay? She was in labor. When she got off the elevator, she slumped to the floor in the hallway. Okay? Now here’s where I’m talking about the most egregious falsification and lie. She slumps to the floor. We see that this woman is in distress. I watched video after video after video of this rescue, so I know what I’m talking about. I was at the trials, you see Will Goodman in the hallway. You see him go in the door of the abortion center. So you know that door was not blocked. He went right in. 10 seconds later, gene Marshall comes out, you see her come out of the door. She goes directly over to Shanti, holler. She stoops down next to her.

(08:00):

She strokes her cheek, she pats her hand. In other words, she is giving her comforting, compassionate gestures. And by the way, there’s no audio unfortunately in the hallway. This is the camera from the building in the hallway, but it’s just a video and no audio. But you can see that Jean Marshall is very concerned about this woman is there to help her, is there to understand what her problem is. What’s the lie? When Jean Marshall, Jean Marshall needs a hip replacement? This is an elderly woman, okay? She’s got arthritis. When she attempted to get up, remember she’s in a stooping position next to shanty holler. When she gets up, she put her hand on shanty hollers shoulder to steady herself. Okay? Now what’s the lie? The lie is from the prosecutors. And the judge just swallowed the Kool-Aid that Jean Marshall was pushing shanty holler down so that shanty holler couldn’t get up.

(09:11):

Okay? Ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. And poor Jean has to suffer this lie. And they even used the word that Jean Marshall accosted, shanty holler in the hallway, forbidding her to get up so that shanty could go into the abortion center. And by the way, even yesterday, I heard it again from the judge where the doctor was waiting to take care of her. Guess what? Folks? San Angelo wasn’t even there. He hadn’t even arrived yet. He doesn’t come until all these women are prepped. And he comes in the afternoon. And how do I know that? Because I spent 12 hours this past week with the two. I’m going to say they’re living Saints, iia, and Adriana. They’re outside of that abortion mill building five days a week. They know his routine. He comes in the afternoon. So he wasn’t even there. So here’s the lie, and this is what these pro-lifers have had to suffer that they used force and violence to stop abortion.

(10:19):

And that’s why, okay, if they had not been charged, and here’s the other thing that your viewers here really need to understand. What’s the problem with this rescue? Look at rescues have been going on blocking doors, even to the point where our group, back in the 1980s and 1990s, citizens for, we blocked the doors to abortion centers with cars, junk cars in front of the door. We had people chained up to ’em the whole nine yards. Nobody ever got charged with face. We did it all. Well, except for the last one when we did it when face was already signed by Clinton. But in any case, those, okay, maybe digress there a little bit. June 4th, 1994, about 20 days after Clinton had signed the freedom of access to clinic entrances act, we put a couple of cars in front of the door to an abortion center in Milwaukee. People were chained up to the car. We got tons of news coverage out of that front page in Milwaukee Journal. Everybody got charged with face. They spent, okay, I’m going to quote unquote, three months in jail, three federal prison. Okay?

(11:33):

Now, fast forward here to the year 2020, when this group, these 10 people, there’s actually 10 altogether, did the San Angelo rescue the first time in the history of legalized abortion in the history of the rescue movement, blockading abortion so that the babies would be protected? These rescuers were charged with an additional count, the count number one, conspiracy to interfere with civil rights. First time in the history of legalized abortion and the pro-life rescue movement that has a 10 year prison term and a $250,000 fine. That’s why these rescuers are spending months, if not years in federal prison.

Mark Harrington (12:26):

It’s because of the conspiracy charges, not the face charge,

Monica Miller (12:29):

Just not because of the face charge, even with the allegations of unquote violence like accosting, shanty, hollerer in the hallway, at most they would have a year, and with good time, they’re probably doing seven to eight months. But here we are with that additional charge, the conspiracy to interfere with civil rights. And this is why everything is just about the worst it could be at this point.

Mark Harrington (12:56):

Right? And so I want to take a moment here and just make it clear. This rescue was held in Washington DC maybe it’s the state of Maryland though, correct? Or no? Was it in the DC district?

Monica Miller (13:10):

Columbia in Maryland, yes.

Mark Harrington (13:11):

Okay. And Sari San Angelo is the abortionist. And he’s in a late term, this guy, they’re all bad. But this is, you’re talking about these, the so-called procedure, which Monica described is beyond barbaric. The fact that we’re even describing this on this podcast is sickening to begin with. It’s so disgusting that this is actually taking place. And he likely is violating two federal laws. That is the partial birth abortion law and the Unborn Infant Protection Act, which of course, the Department of Justice doesn’t have anything, doesn’t care about those. It’s those peaceful pro-lifers. We got to throw in prison. The

Monica Miller (13:56):

Other thing, and many of your viewers probably know this, but March 25th, 2022, Lauren Handy and Theresa Konick were outside of that abortion, the building where the abortion clinic is located up on the fourth floor, the medical waste. Curtis Bay truck pulled up, I think in the alley, which is right along the side of the building. And they asked the driver, he was loading boxes into the truck and they asked him for the boxes, and he gave them the boxes. And they contained 115, the remains of 115 aborted babies, 110 of them have already been buried. The first trimester abortions. Five of those victims were very late term, no question. Second late term. Second and third trimester aborted babies. Unbelievable. Mark, I’ve seen thousands of bodies of aborted babies that we’ve taken out of the trash over these years from six weeks to seven months gestational age.

(15:12):

I’ve shed my tears for those bodies, those babies that we photographed, we buried. But I cried new tears when I saw the photographs of those five. And here’s the other real problem with the trial in Washington DC and why our friends are suffering the injustice of going to prison. This was, again, over and over again. This is the way it goes. The pro-life trials are sanitized, no defense of others, no defensive necessity. The jury never knew anything about these five late term babies that are still in cold storage at the DC Medical Examiner’s office. No real investigation has yet to take place. There was a threat some months ago that the medical examiner was going to destroy the bodies, and that would’ve been the end of it. But thankfully, there was some congressmen, maybe even Senator Ted Cruz who intervened. They didn’t destroy the bodies, at least not yet. If the jury had seen those babies, if the jury had been allowed to watch even the whole B roll of the live action undercover video, they would’ve heard, they would’ve seen the bodies. They would’ve seen why these rescuers did what they did.

(16:35):

And if they had seen the live action video, the live action video, you see San Angelo say to the undercover live action undercover person there, they ask him about, well, what happens if the fetuses are some of them ever born alive? He said, occasionally that happens. Not often, but occasionally. And then he goes on to say, well, then they ask him, well, what do you do? He said, nothing. We don’t do anything. In other words, we let them die. He said it. Now, if the jury had been privy to the photographs, to the humanity of the babies that San Angelo is murdering, and maybe the verdict would’ve been a lot different, but I’ve got a couple of articles that I wrote about my experience watching the jury selection. Oh my gosh, look at, she allowed jurors to stay on the jury pool who even said they give to Planned Parenthood. They’d been to pro-abortion marches. All they had to do was say the magic words, that they could be unbiased in rendering a verdict to say the magic words. No matter how pro-abortion you are, you get to stay in the jury pool. That means that the pro-life attorneys have to waste their strikes to get them off because she could strike them for cause. But she didn’t. And there’s no question that there were rapidly,

Mark Harrington (18:11):

We all know this is a, as we say, trumped up trial. And Donald Trump’s trials are trumped up too. But this is a concerted effort by the Biden administration to silence pro-life speech and activism. This is more than just the nine, which is bad enough, but it’s a shot over the bow of the pro-life movement. And I have told people this, and I’ll tell ’em again, if Joe Biden gets back into the White House, it’s open season, not that it hasn’t been in the last several years for peaceful pro-life actors, activists, pro-life organizations, groups, individuals, so forth in the next four years. And those who don’t like Donald Trump, I’m just telling you, you don’t have to vote for him. Vote against Biden. Isn’t that good enough? Keep him out because I’m telling you what, this is just the beginning Friends, if we don’t put an end to this, and the only way in my view is to vote Joe Biden out. And I don’t want to get into the political necessarily with you, Monica, but I appreciate the update. What I’d like to do now is we have this new case now, which has been the Department of Justice is now going to sue two organizations and seven individuals for violating faith. It’s not criminal face, it’s civil meaning. They’re just civil penalties. And I want to save you from, here’s the, I know you’d speak on it. I know you’re named in the case. I think it’d be probably

Monica Miller (19:55):

Named Citizens for Pro-Life Society is being sued by the Department of Justice with Red Rose Rescue.

Mark Harrington (20:04):

Right. But in order to just, you’re already in enough deep water here. It may be better not to get into the details of this particular case unless you wish to. What I’d like to, and you can speak to it in a way that you feel comfortable, but I don’t want to go anywhere where you wouldn’t be comfortable talking about it. But the Justice Department is now suing individual pro-life activists, not for violating criminal face, which is includes these conspiracy counts, but civil face, which is basically compensatory damages, monetary penalties, and asking for injunctive relief that are in the face act. So if you would just quickly share what that means, because I know this is an ongoing case now, and it’s important that as I’m not your attorney, but I think we as people monitor all pro-life organizations these days, you got to wonder, and I’m just asking you if you would give us what’s going on there with this new case. It was just last, what, three days ago. Department of Justice is now suing your organization, you and six other individuals.

Monica Miller (21:24):

Right? This has to do with two rescues Brad Rose rescues that took place in Ohio in June, early June of 2021. So we’re going almost three years ago. And four rescuers entered the Northeast Ohio Women’s Clinic, did a Red Rose rescue in the waiting room. They were arrested and charged with trespassing. That was on June 4th. The next day a Red Rose rescue took place at the Planned Parenthood in Bedford Heights, Ohio. I participated in that. And this rescue only took place on the parking lot. We never entered the abortion center except for one of the rescuers, Jay Smith, who also participated in the rescue there in dc. Little story there, but okay, your listeners, viewers need to realize, and I’m saying this over and over and over again, and all my media interviews that I’ve done this week, red Rose Rescue does not violate the freedom of access to clinic entrances Act. We’ve done 37 of these rescues since 2017. Nobody has been charged ever with the freedom of access to clinic entrances act. We do not use any kind of physical obstruction of the women coming to the clinic. The staff, we don’t block doors, we don’t block hallways, we don’t interfere. And that’s actually technical language in the face act interference with reproductive healthcare means in the face act that you do something to interfere with someone else’s freedom of movement. We don’t do that.

Mark Harrington (23:27):

Yeah. And let me jump in here. This is really, really important for people to understand. You specifically created at least in some level the Red Rose rescue to not violate the freedom to access clinic. I mean, that was an intention of your efforts.

Monica Miller (23:46):

Yes to,

Mark Harrington (23:47):

And I think that’s important for people to understand. Even though face is an unconstitutional law against free speech and freedom of expression, civil disobedience, whatever you want to call it, has had its storied history in America continues to and should at certain levels and it’s a unconstitutional law should never have been enacted and should be repealed. But despite that, you went out of your way to not violate

Monica Miller (24:16):

It. Correct? Well, it’s a 40 page complaint that was handed down on Monday. So this is all very fresh from the Department of Justice and they’re just concocting ridiculous falsifications regarding what we did, what we said, misinterpretation of our actions. We didn’t block anything or anyone. And here we are. What’s going on? They’re stretching the meaning. They’re going to try to stretch. They’re going to have this novel interpretation of obstruction. We’ll see if our attorneys, most of them are going to be helping us out from the Thomas Moore Society in Chicago. And they’re chomping at the bit to go forward with this case because we have solid ground to defend ourselves. And just to be honest, the rescue that took place at San Angelo’s back in 2020, look, the rescuers knew that they were going to most likely be charged with face. They knew that they were going in there. They’re going to stand in front of the door that leads to the procedure killing rooms. The problem with that rescue, of course, that they got charged with the additional charge. We do red rose rescues, we know we are not going to get charged with face. We’ve only had most of the charges. By the way, some of our cases have been not guilty and charges dismissed and the most we’ve ever, ever suffered a 90 day jail term for

Mark Harrington (25:49):

Some. Well, and it’s also an indication that they didn’t charge you with criminal face. That’s kind of an omission, at least at that level that you’re not violating face. Interesting. And I want to move on to some of the, let’s say objections to the tactic before we finish the program. But in this Department of Justice memo, press release, at the end of it, it says this, and this is really, I think at the heart of the issue, it says, we encourage anyone with information about potential faced act violations to contact our office. They are fishing, fishing for these types of cases that they can bring against peaceful pro-life activists. And this again is a problem because we have to get Joe Biden out of office if you would. Monica, there’s been some criticism of this tactic. Of course, I’ve talked about it on the program with you and others over the years.

(26:53):

Here’s the thing, I’ll just say this in light of the nine that were sentenced and now the seven plus your two organizations that have now been named in a new lawsuit, I just want to tell people this. This is not the time to accuse pro-life activists who are risking their freedom to go to jail or prison in this case, to start throwing shade on ’em. Friends, this really upsets me. There’s a time and place to talk about this. It’s not now, it’s not to question them. Their motives, the tactic, whether it works, whether it doesn’t. From that perspective, it’s just not. This is a time to be in prayerful consideration of those folks who felt compelled between them and God, their own conscience to do what they felt was necessary, peacefully, friends, nonviolent, passive resistance completely within the realms of what we would believe to be ethical, acting out our faith.

(28:08):

And really when I read articles criticizing and this and that, at the very time that people are going to jail and it’s being sentenced to multiple years in prison, it really, really upsets me. But that said, I do want to give you an opportunity to defend the position that you take from some. So I think it’s important that you take this time to kind of clear some things up that have been levied against you in your organization. And those who have done this, the first is this. They’ll say that the Red Rose rescue or rescue, particularly whatever you want to call, either one of ’em, doesn’t really matter, doesn’t save lives. They’ll say, well, if you sidewalk council, if you just peacefully hold signs out front, that’s the best way and most effective way to save lives. How do you respond to that?

Monica Miller (28:59):

Well, first of all, that is untrue. We have had babies saved from abortion through our Red Rose rescues in Silver Spring, Maryland. And that rescue that Lauren Handy participated in as well as Jonathan Darnell, a Hispanic woman, was the last woman to come for her abortion. Lauren Handy talked to her. She said, okay, I’m going to leave. I’m keeping my baby. There you go. And that wouldn’t have happened unless they were in the waiting room to talk to her because she already went past the sidewalk counselors that were down on the street.

Mark Harrington (29:39):

And if anybody’s been out front of a clinic, they know 90% of the girls going in, the parents go in are going to go right past the protest or straight in the doors.

Monica Miller (29:48):

Exactly. Look, I’ve been a sidewalk counselor for over 40 years. I’ve written articles and sidewalk counseling is the backbone of pro-life activism. I think rescues might should be, but we know that it’s sidewalk counseling. And yes, most of the moms are not going to listen to the sidewalk counselors. So here’s the thing, are we supposed to just let them go into the abortion mill and still go ahead and kill their children? What are we doing in a Red Rose rescue? We’re not protesting abortion, we’re not blocking anything. Really what we’re doing, we’re kind of moving sidewalk counseling into the waiting room. We cap our presence at six, no more than six pro-lifers go in because we’re not gluing the waiting room with a bunch of protestors. Okay? We want to go in as quietly as incognito as we possibly can to stay in that waiting room. As long as we can talk to the moms, give them that final opportunity to say, alright, you’ve convinced me I’m not going to go ahead with this abortion and leave. And we’ve had couples take the roses and leave. So I don’t know, how do our detractors even know that we don’t save babies from

Mark Harrington (31:06):

Abortion? They probably don’t. Let’s move on to the next one. We

Monica Miller (31:11):

Have proof from a Red Rose rescue trial that we had here in Michigan in 2018. We did a rescue at the Women’s Center in West Bloomfield, and the clinic manager gets on the witness stand under oath complete with a chart, okay? She’s actually got a chart of the 12 women who didn’t go through with their abortion procedure that day and did not from her own mouth reschedule. And we know that one of the women cited in the chart was a woman that left the abortion center during the rescue after Patrice Woodward talked to her. Okay, so let’s say that our detractors, our critics are right. Nobody ever gets saved. No babies ever get saved in a rescue. The point of the point though is that nonetheless, the unborn child has a right to someone standing up for him or her that someone went in there to say, look, if you’re going to kill this baby, you got to go through me. You have to remove my presence from this killing place. They deserve that. It’s an act of charity for the unwanted, and it’s a perfectly legitimate way of standing up in a peaceful, loving, compassionate way still for the moms to beg those moms to honor the life of their children and to defend. They have a right to that defense and it has to be loving. It has to be nonviolent because we have to reach people, but at the same time, we have to defend the defenseless and that’s what a rescue is about.

Mark Harrington (33:03):

Alright, so the next question is this, or one of those who say these are not a good idea. They’ll say that these efforts, red Rose Rescue, regular rescue, if you will, create bubble zones reactions from city councils or city government, state government to create these zones to which peaceful pro-life, sidewalk councils who normally would’ve access to a sidewalk now are told they have to be outside a so-called bubble zone. Is that true? Number one. And have there ever been bubble zones enacted in response to these rescues?

Monica Miller (33:50):

There has never been a bubble zone erected in response to a Red Rose rescue except for perhaps one exception. Red Rose rescue faced a complaint from Letitia James, the attorney general of the state of New York, and she was able to obtain a preliminary injunction against Red Rose rescue. However, the injunction is meaningless. The injunction stipulates that anyone with the intention of participating entering a clinic, and by the way, it’s only in two counties in New York. It doesn’t cover the entire, it’s only two counties where the injunction is in place. Anyone with the intention of entering an abortion or abortion clinic in order to interfere with reproductive healthcare, a K red rose rescue is subject to the enforcement of this injunction. Well, if you don’t have an intention of doing a red Rose rescue, the injunction doesn’t cover you. I mean, it’s like,

Mark Harrington (34:57):

Yeah, so that’s not a bubble zone. A bubble zone is a particular distance that pro-life activists have to be beyond.

Monica Miller (35:05):

Yeah. Well there is a distance in there if you have

Mark Harrington (35:08):

The intent, but it’s only to those who might go inside. Yes, yes, exactly. Okay, so that’s different.

Monica Miller (35:13):

Our attorneys say it’s meaningless. So, so far that’s what we’ve been having to deal with.

Mark Harrington (35:21):

All right, we got one left before we let you go. And that is this people for good reason. We Christians are typically, and we should be law abiding people. The most law abiding honestly, they will say the others who are not for this particular tactic, that this is a law-breaking strategy. How do you respond?

Monica Miller (35:47):

I’m going to stand on the shoulders of St. Thomas Aquinas. Even Martin Luther King quoted him in his letter from the Birmingham Jail that if there is a law that is not consistent with the eternal law of God, it is not a law at all. But violence and any law that permits the extermination of innocent human beings is not a true law. And if that’s the accusation that we’re law breakers and we don’t have respect for the law, but you got to tell that to all the people like the Cory 10 booms of this world that hit Jews in their attic and we’re violating the Nazi laws regarding the protection of Jews and the hiding of Jews, I’m sorry. This is absolutely completely vacuous when it comes to objective reality.

Mark Harrington (36:41):

Well, and they would call it a strategy of law breaking. In other words, that’s the point of your effort. And that’s what they would say,

Monica Miller (36:50):

Oh, well no.

Mark Harrington (36:53):

Right.

Monica Miller (36:54):

We don’t want to be arrested. We do not want the police to come. We do not want to go to court. I mean, we suffer those things as a continuation of our witness to the sanctity of life. But our intention is not to break the law. Our intention is to defend the innocent with the indirect consequence, if you will, of enduring or having to suffer being arrested and going to court and possibly spending some time in jail. By the way, let me talk about jail for a second because that’s also another detraction. You’re wasting your time. You’re taken off the street now, you’re not able to do pro-life work out at the abortion centers. Look at when I was in prison jail here at what I call the Oakland County Hilton. You’re in Michigan. We talked women out of abortions who were pregnant and when they got out, whatever, a lot of them there for drugs or whatever, a retail theft. This is not downtime. This is our mission field where we are continuing our witness to the sanctity of life, even behind bars.

Mark Harrington (38:08):

Right? Well, it’d be like saying that Paul being in prison was downtime. The apostle Paul was downtime. Yes. Right. He wrote a lot of us. The epistles were written from prison.

Monica Miller (38:18):

Right, right. His captivity, exactly

Mark Harrington (38:21):

My guess has been Monica Miller and she is the president of Citizens for a Pro-Life Society. Monica, if you would give a call to action to those who are listening today, have been following the case, and if they haven’t, now they know what’s going on with the case. With the nine pro-life activists who have been sentenced to prison and now these seven plus two organizations, both of ’em, yours who have now been charged with civil face, if you would just give a kind of call to action and encouragement to those who are looking at the landscape ahead of us and seems very troubling, very problematic, if you would close out the show with that.

Monica Miller (39:03):

Well, we can’t be afraid. I mean, we are living in very, very dark and troubling times. And now it’s not the time to retreat or to play it safe. If you’re a Christian, you have to live your faith and carry your cross and go with our Lord to calvary and be with him. And I think that right now, one of the closest, deepest, most profound way that you can be with our Lord is to be with the unwanted, to be with the rejected. And where are they? Their moms are carrying them, the unborn into the abortion centers. We have to be there. We should be continuing Red Rose rescues and just allow ourselves, we need to be involved in what I call radical acts of love, radical acts of love. And that means that there is an element of self-sacrifice. And we’re not going to end abortion thinking pro-life thoughts. We’re going to end abortion with pro-life action. So let’s get in there and let’s do the work to end abortion.

Mark Harrington (40:19):

Well, we appreciate you being on the program, Monica Miller, again with Citizens for Pro-Life, society, and friends. I want you to begin to pray if you haven’t already begun to pray for the nine that have now been sentenced and are facing some of them multiple years in prison for what they did to defend unborn babies. And now this new case, which has been the Department of Justice is brought against Monica, her two organizations and six pro-life individuals in the Ohio region if you would. Monica, thanks for being on the program, and we’ll be talking again as this case continues on, we’ll be praying that it gets dismissed and we’ll pray for your attorneys and your legal counsel and all of those who are involved in trying to defend the unborn in the way that you have led them. God bless you for your work.

Monica Miller (41:12):

Thank you, God be with you. Thank you for everything, mark.

Mark Harrington (41:17):

Well. Friends, I hope you enjoyed the interview with Dr. Monica McMill from Citizens for a Pro-Life society. And you can find out more about her organization by going to pro-life society.net pro-life society.net. And I know some of us will differ in our views regarding this particular tactic, whether it’s traditional rescuing, whether it’s blockage of doors, that kind of thing, which is one issue. And then the other, which is the Red Rose rescue, which is going inside and offering a red rose in counseling, a refusing to leave trespassing, if you will. There might be differences of opinion on all of this, and that’s okay. That’s fine. I don’t know where you all land, and it’s up to you as to what you decide on all of this. And as you can tell, I will kind of defer to the individual before God as to what they wish they should do or what they should decide to do based between them and God.

(42:17):

Where I would draw the line of course, is violence. Passive nonviolent resistance has a storied past historically in America and biblically. And we can defend that. You may not think it’s the smartest thing, it might not be the most effective thing. You might disagree on all of that, but I want to give people these that do this type of thing, as long as they stay nonviolent and peaceful, their voices need to be heard because they are paying the price for what they believe. And you got to give ’em that. You got to give them that friends. And so the scripture says, we must obey God rather than amend the apostles. Were told not to speak about Jesus. We can go throughout the scripture and find all kinds of stories, whether it’s Daniel praying, whether it’s the Hebrews midwives and so forth and so on throughout Scripture where when confronted with being told or forced to do something that would disobey God, Christians need to take a stand and say, we obey God rather than men.

(43:24):

And so a lot of people call it civil disobedience. You might want to call it that. I call it biblical obedience. And I’ve been a long time supporter of nonviolent passive resistance and will continue to be a supporter of that. Doesn’t mean I’ll do it, doesn’t mean I support and tell others to do it, but others, if they felt within them and their position between themselves and God and their own conscience decide to do something of this nature, I’m not going to stand in their way and nor will I criticize them for that. And so I don’t think it’s the time to be doing that. We can talk about the efficacy of this and whether it’s the best way forward in order to bring protections to unborn children that’s open for discussion. I think that’s fair game, but not right now. Not right now. Let’s not attack these people and judge their character and the effectiveness of it. And hopefully you got that message from Monica Miller today. So you’ve been listening to your radioactives here on the Mark Harrington show. Go to mark harrington.org to find out more. We’ll see you next time. God bless you. God bless America, and remember America to bless God.

Outro (44:42):

You’ve been listening to Mark Harrington, your radio activist. For more information on how to make a difference for the cause of life, liberty and justice, go to created equal.org.org. To follow mark, go to Mark Harrington show.com. Be sure to tune in next time for your marching orders in the culture war.